Wednesday, August 03, 2011

Anders Behring Breivik's 'Christian Europe'

Where Does Europe End?
(Image from Wikipedia)

Somewhere in a blog comment, I suggested that Breivik is a "cultural Christian," and I see that he uses this expression in his Manifesto to identify himself, but he has given more thought to the role of the Christian church than most Europeans who are culturally Christian, so we might say that he is very serious about his cultural Christianity. Anyway, here's what I managed to obtain from his Manifesto on his vision of Christianity:
3.139 Distinguishing between cultural Christendom and religious Christendom; reforming our suicidal Church:

A majority of so called agnostics and atheists in Europe are cultural conservative Christians without even knowing it. So what is the difference between cultural Christians and religious Christians?

If you have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ and God then you are a religious Christian. Myself and many more like me do not necessarily have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ and God. We do however believe in Christianity as a cultural, social, identity and moral platform. This makes us Christian.

A majority of Christians, especially liberal, humanist Christians oppose the doctrines of self defence. I believe that self defence is a central part of Christianity as documented in another part of this book. The modern day pacifist Christianity is among other things a result of our current regimes and their deliberate influence of the Church. They castrated and made the Church impotent and irrelevant, we will rejuvenate it by implementing our own reforms. But pragmatism will be the basis for which direction we chose to go. A strong church (on certain areas) is essential for the unity of our European countries.

It is essential that we preserve and even strengthen the Church and European Christendom in general (by awarding it more political influence on certain areas), when it comes to the moral, cultural and social aspects of society. It should even be granted monopoly on certain areas to strengthen European cohesion/unity. This does not mean that we will continue allow the feminist-liberal, humanist faction of the Church to propagate its pacifist-humanist (suicidal) views/anti self defence doctrines. The Church must be anti-pacifist in the manner that it actively preaches self-defence and even support preemptive strikes as a mechanic to safeguard either Christian minorities in Muslim dominated areas or even Europe itself. We must ensure that a sustainable and traditional version of Christendom is propagated. This will involve that we take decisive steps to disallow the liberal leaders of the church to prevent them from committing suicide. We must ensure that the churches of Europe propagate . . . values that are sustainable and that will even contribute to safeguard Christian European values long term. European Christendom and the cross will be the symbol in which every cultural conservative can unite under in our common defence. It should serve as the uniting symbol for all Europeans whether they are agnostic or atheists.

The pacifist/suicidal Christians must never be allowed to dominate the church again which one of the reasons why I personally believe that the protestant Church in Europe should once again should reform to become Catholic (Nordic countries, the UK, Germany, Benelux etc). Re-introduction of cultural and Church aspects relating to honour should be the core of our objective when reforming the Church. My hope is that the future nationalist leadership in Western European countries will agree. At the very least, we must support the conservative, anti-pacifist cultural Christian leaders and ensure that they are able to influence the European churches. There must however be clear distinctions. The Church must not put any limits whatsoever on issues relating to science, research and development. Europe will continue to be the world's center for research and development in all areas, strengthened by a predictable and unchangeable cultural framework. This again will considerably strengthen European and societal cohesion and therefore contribute to sustainable societies where harmony, progress, freedom and the furtherance of mankind are the primary civilisational pillars.
So far as I can determine, Breivik envisions a Europe of nationalistic states culturally united by a Christian church that has returned to its 'Catholic' roots but has little political power to impose dogma.

This seems to presuppose some kind of overarching European political framework, but I don't know what sort, and I can't manage to upload the entire Manifesto with my browser, so I'll have to deal with this and other passages some time later on.

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At 6:05 AM, Blogger ilTassista Marino said...

Where Does Europe End?

Don't ask Europeans. Politicians here are at each other's throat over the decision whether Turkey can, or cannot, become a member of the EU, and why. Pope Benedict XVI himself changed his mind a couple of times.

At 6:44 AM, Blogger Horace Jeffery Hodges said...

I used to think that Turkey should be let in, but I'm like the Pope in having changed my mind . . . though only once.

But "end" -- as in the Hitchhiker's Guide -- can have more than one meaning . . .

Jeffery Hodges

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At 2:25 PM, Blogger ilTassista Marino said...

the so-often-called Neurozone

At 2:31 PM, Blogger Horace Jeffery Hodges said...

Yeah, I've often called it that . . .

Jeffery Hodges

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At 2:48 PM, Blogger ilTassista Marino said...

Speaking of "Christian Europe." Dante is often called "The Father of Our Country" (Italy), on the basis of a couple of decontextualized verses, BUT he should rather be considered a Father of the EU, since he wished a strong central political power, the "German" Emperor. In fact, when he mentions Italy - and other European countries, especially France - he blames their attempts to attain a complete independence.

Dante's "national myth" is so widespread that even members of the Dante Alighieri Society happen to be surprised by these remarks, though after a second thought they have to admit that the Poet had an Eurocentric view.

At 2:51 PM, Blogger ilTassista Marino said...

... or, "a" Eurocentric view?

The N-connection (N-euro) strikes back :-)

At 5:21 PM, Blogger Horace Jeffery Hodges said...

The N-euro-zone is currency-tly the new-roses-zone . . .

Jeffery Hodges

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At 5:30 PM, Blogger ilTassista Marino said...

Guns & Roses zone, unfortunately

At 6:42 PM, Blogger Horace Jeffery Hodges said...

Perhaps . . . though Norway isn't even in the EU.

Jeffery Hodges

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At 8:11 PM, Blogger ilTassista Marino said...

oops - shame on me! - I forgot.

their hymn says, "And what's much more... much more than this... I did it Nooor-waaayyy!"

At 8:29 PM, Blogger Horace Jeffery Hodges said...

One would have expected them to show EUropean solidarity!

Jeffery Hodges

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At 8:34 PM, Blogger ilTassista Marino said...

EU me miserum!

___Marcus Tullius Cicero

At 8:41 PM, Blogger Horace Jeffery Hodges said...

I always just knew the EU was a new Roman Empire!

Jeffery Hodges

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At 12:06 AM, Anonymous Scott A. said...

What was Dante's reasoning for the need of a strong central unifying entity? Did it have to do with the Other?

At 12:23 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Didn't Dante want a one world government under the rule of the Pope?

At 12:48 AM, Blogger ilTassista Marino said...

Oh, no, Kuiwon: Dante wanted one Empire under the rule of the German Emperor, that's why the Pope had him sentenced to death (by simplifying the events a bit) and Dante had to flee. Moreover, what he called "the world" was basically Europe.

As for his "reasoning," (thanks for the cue, Scott) Dante thought that one central power would be more righteous, since the Emperor, being the Lord of all, would not cause wars against anybody in order to conquer new territories. That is, honestly, quite a naive theory; Dante could do better than that.

At 3:26 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Dante had other not-so-smart ideas. In particular, I disliked Dante for his appraisal of vernaculars.

At 3:54 AM, Blogger Horace Jeffery Hodges said...

Dante always hijacks these threads! He's still sore at Milton for outdoing him on the Christian epic, so he slips his ideas into my blog whenever he can. He's the snake in the garden who wants to make this place his own Paradise Lost . . .

Jeffery Hodges

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At 6:08 AM, Blogger ilTassista Marino said...

I disliked Dante for his appraisal of vernaculars

recte sensisti. valde decorius enim latine loqui, etsi putandum remotos non omnes amicos - qui "cyberfriends" appellantur - nobiliorem linguam comprehendere. verum est traditio quaedam ferre, Dantem primos VII cantos inferni latine scripsisse.

Dante anyway did not like ALL vernaculars. E.g, he despised the very dialect of the area I currently live in, Umbria (with Assisi, St Francis' homeland).

At 6:11 AM, Blogger ilTassista Marino said...

Na, Jeff: in Purgatorio, Dante himself says that envy is not among his worst sins.

At 11:13 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Ah. It's been a long time since I've had to read Latin outside my Hand-missal which I use when I go to Mass.

He wrote chapter VII in Latin is what I gather. Also, I think a few of the words aren't of the correct declension -- atqui non certe sentio.

At 2:14 PM, Blogger ilTassista Marino said...


alas, writing in a hurry, and at 11 p.m., does no good in no language. In fact, the phrase "primos VII cantos" is wrong, it should read something like "pristina VII carmina."

Anyway, here's a translation of our little joke:

You're right, it is much more honorable to speak Latin, although it must be considered that not all of our far away friends (aka cyberfriebds) may be able to understand the nobler language. It is anyway true that, according to one tradition, Dante wrote in Latin the first seven Cantos of Inferno.


At 2:30 PM, Blogger Horace Jeffery Hodges said...

Dante "despised the very dialect of the area I currently live in . . ."

No wonder, either! I couldn't understand a word of it!

Jeffery Hodges

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At 2:32 PM, Blogger Horace Jeffery Hodges said...

"Dante himself says that envy is not among his worst sins . . ."

Sure, and you believed him? He envies Milton's generosity.

Jeffery Hodges

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At 8:14 PM, Blogger ilTassista Marino said...

The infernal spirit of Dante just asked me to reply:

"Those who envy are those who cannot see, Mr Milton."

(That's the original meaning of "invidia," see the second circle in Purgatorio)

At 9:52 PM, Blogger Horace Jeffery Hodges said...

Milton replies, "There are none so blind as those who will not see, Mr. Alighieri."

Jeffery Hodges

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